and john boehner spoke by phone about the fiscal cliff negotiations, but there is no progress. they still have a stand off over the rates. the president still wants to raise rates on the top 2% of americans. the speaker is not moving on that position. this comes on the same day that secretary geithner made it clear in language they have not used before, just how far they're willing to go in the administration to stand by those terms. >> is the administration prepared today go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. there is no agreement without those rates going up on the top 2%. and they all get a tax cut on the first $250,000 of their income. >> reporter: so wolf, it's a step forward that they're talking, but in essence, where we stand right now, it's still a stalemate. >> any indication that the vice president, secretary of treasury, others are talking with top people on capitol hill? meeting face to face and going through these items line by line? >> reporter: my understanding is that the white house is not going to start negotiating the details until they hear either more specifics from republicans on the rest of their pl

boehner's proposal to avert the fiscal cliff? >> unfortunately, the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks about $800 billion worth of revenues but says he's going to do that by lowering rates. when you look at the math, it doesn't work. >> reporter: he won't agree to eliminate a tax deduction for contributions to charity. >> every hospital and university and nonfor profit agency across the country would find themselves on the verge of collapse. so that's not a realistic option. >> reporter: but the president didn't say all this to speaker boehner. he said it in an interview on bloomberg tv. the last time the two men spoke was almost a week ago. president obama is focused on the stalemate with congress over averting the fiscal cliff, but he's just not talking to house republicans about it. at the white house, he discussed the issue with a bipartisan group of governors. >> i know that the president wants a deal and he didn't try to handicap it. >> reporter: earlier this week, he told so-called middle class americans on twitter, keep pressure on congress. he's even ventured outside the beltway rallying supporters to do just that. >> i'm going to be asking for you to be making your

fiscal cliff, that difference between tax rates for the wealthiest americans. and what house democrats announced they're going to try to do is an end run around the house gop to try to file a petition in order to try to push a vote on the house floor to just raise taxes -- excuse me, to just extend the bush-era tax rates for middle class americans. but to do that, as you know, they need 218 votes and there's still a very sizable republican majority in the house. it will be difficult for democrats to do that. >> absolutely. and that proposal to take away what has been historically a congressional prerogative was a little bit surprising even to people who have been reading about this stuff for years. is it true though, dana, as it has been in past years that both sides at least have to show their bases that they're fighting the good fight and that's part of what's going on here? >> reporter: absolutely. there's no question about it. what i mention in the piece really is a real phenomenon here when it comes to the feeling among congressional democrats that they are saying halleluijah. the

compromise in order to avoid going over the fiscal cliff? john boehner's already $800 billion in increased tax revenue, not necessarily raising the marginal tax rate on the wealthy, but capping deductions, limiting loopholes, are you with the speaker of the house on that? >> unfortunately, wolf, the policies of president obama have already taken us over the cliff. if you meet with businesses like i do all the time, they've already paired back plans for next year anticipating what's going to happen. we can fix this christmas eve if we want, but we've already hurt the economy and job growth. >> are you with boehner? >> i'm not with boehner. this government doesn't need anymore money. this country needs less government. we're going to have historic levels of revenue to the government this year. >> everyone's taxes are going up at the end of the year if there's no deal. >> we have already offered to extend current tax rates. that's what we should have done six months ago until we could come to some agreement, some compromise on tax reform. >> when you say compromise, where are you ready to compromise as far as taxes are concerned? >> how we go about tax

to save the $2.2 trillion and avoid the so-called fiscal cliff. the across-the-board spending cuts and sharp tax increases that hit in just 29 days. let's get straight to our senior congressional correspondent dana bash. she's watching what's going on. dana, the tax rates, first of all, let's get to a major sticking point right now. there's been a counterproposal from house republicans to the white house. you have details. >> reporter: that's right. let's start exactly where you just began on those tax rates because that has become the big divide between the two sides. the answer is the house republicans are not budging. they still want to continue the bush era tax rates at all income levels. let's get specific. first of all, the counterproposal, they say they would get about $800 billion in savings from what they call tax reform, from deductions and closing loopholes, things like that. but the bush era tax rates, all of them would remain, even for the wealthiest. to show you the difference, compared to the white house offer that they got last week, $1.6 trillion in savings when it comes to tax revenue. but much of that came from raising tax rates for the wealthiest americans, which of course is what president obama campaigned on. so those are the big differe